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 veryhotthread  Author  Topic: Anti-TLLDOB people: Why don't you like the album?  (Read 3471 times)
NoSonOfVine
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question Anti-TLLDOB people: Why don't you like the album?
« Thread started on: May 14th, 2017, 04:28am »

Note that this thread isn't designed to shame those who aren't into the album! wink

For those that don't like TLLDOB - why not? To me this album is a thrilling roller-coaster ride comprised of many of Genesis's best moments and one of the most diversely entertaining and ingenious albums ever made. Is it the lyrics? Because the album's lyrics are admittedly pretty gory and gross at times; there are numerous references to blood, illness and slime, not to mention multiple graphic sexual innuendos. For that reason I can understand someone being put off the album, as references to stomach aches and skin diseases are certainly unpleasant.
« Last Edit: May 14th, 2017, 09:25am by NoSonOfVine » User IP Logged

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question Re: Anti-TLLDOB people: Why don't you like the alb
« Reply #1 on: May 14th, 2017, 07:45am »

ĒDonít likeĒ are strong words, but Iím having difficulties appreciating TLLDOB fully. It has entirely to do with the strange story and the strange lyrics, as NSOV suggested. Musically, however, the album contains many extremely good melodies. The same music but with independent lyrics for each song would have suited me much better. Iím simply not fond of concept albums with a stretched out and laboured overall story. TLLDOB has four LP sides, thus four song cycles. Those four song cycles could have had some kind of loose lyric theme going through them. Pink Floyd is another of my favourite bands, and Iím having the same difficulties with The Wall.
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question Re: Anti-TLLDOB people: Why don't you like the alb
« Reply #2 on: May 14th, 2017, 08:11am »

the stories that concept albums tell, as such stories, usually leave me a bit cold. this applies to the lamb, to the beatles' sgt. pepper's, to kate bush's the ninth wave and a sky of honey...

i like those albums and suites because they contain good songs that flow nicely and some good lyrics. but, as i said, i don't find the whole concept particularly interesting.
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question Re: Anti-TLLDOB people: Why don't you like the alb
« Reply #3 on: May 14th, 2017, 08:37am »

(sorry not a why I don't like the album - I do tongue)

The lyrics are definitely a plus for me. Actually, I think the Lamb might be my favourite Genesis album lyrics-wise. I'm not too fussed about the story; it's no great work of art but it does the job. But the actual lyrics themselves are often pretty great. I love the first couple of verses of Slippermen in particular. E.g.:

His skin's all covered in slimy lumps
With lips that slide across each chin
His twisted limbs like rubber stumps
Are waved in welcome, say "please join in"

My grip must be flipping
'Cause his handshake keeps slipping
My hopes keep on dipping
And his lips keep on smiling all the time


It just seems so wonderfully-constructed to me. That rhyming structure in the B parts is such fun.

Ah man, I sometimes forget what a great song that is cool
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xx Re: Anti-TLLDOB people: Why don't you like the alb
« Reply #4 on: May 14th, 2017, 09:20am »

on May 14th, 2017, 07:45am, AnythingNow wrote:
Pink Floyd is another of my favourite bands, and Iím having the same difficulties with The Wall.

Now that's a concept album that after multiple plays I truly never got into. Haven't heard it in years and I have no desire to ever hear it again. It has its moments, but it's overall so miserable and overlong that it just leaves me bored stiff. Sorry to any fans.
« Last Edit: May 14th, 2017, 09:20am by NoSonOfVine » User IP Logged

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xx Re: Anti-TLLDOB people: Why don't you like the alb
« Reply #5 on: May 16th, 2017, 04:58am »

It's interesting that replies so far have focused on the concept and the lyrics, both things that don't really matter much to me. I just love the breadth of what they do musically on this album - for me, it's simply leagues ahead of everything else they did. The story and lyrics are secondary, but I get that they are significant for others.

on May 14th, 2017, 08:11am, Kerry95 wrote:
the beatles' sgt. pepper's

Pepper was originally intended as a concept piece but it didn't end up that way, it's sort-of bookended by the title track and reprise but there's no other 'theme' and it's too much of a stretch to call it a concept album.
« Last Edit: May 16th, 2017, 05:00am by Backdrifter » User IP Logged

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xx Re: Anti-TLLDOB people: Why don't you like the alb
« Reply #6 on: May 16th, 2017, 07:30am »

on May 16th, 2017, 04:58am, Backdrifter wrote:
The story and lyrics are secondary, but I get that they are significant for others.


And for the band I would say, Genesis always put a lot of work into and a lot of empahsis on their lyrics, at least up to a certain point in their career. They cared. I suspect it is even more true for a concept album.
« Last Edit: May 16th, 2017, 07:45am by Fabrizio » User IP Logged

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question Re: Anti-TLLDOB people: Why don't you like the alb
« Reply #7 on: May 16th, 2017, 2:55pm »

I will give my input to this thread when I have a little more time on my hands, right now my bosses at work are going crazy. There's quite a few things I can say on this topic wink
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question Re: Anti-TLLDOB people: Why don't you like the alb
« Reply #8 on: May 17th, 2017, 8:29pm »

I love the lyrics to this album. It's weird and that's why like it. Songs like The Lamia are pure poetry to me. I can see how Peter was influenced by Keats.

BTW I love The Wall as well. To me it's one of the deepest albums ever. Roger really tore his heart on that one.
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question Re: Anti-TLLDOB people: Why don't you like the alb
« Reply #9 on: May 21st, 2017, 03:20am »

I'm with Tony Banks. The story doesn't do much for me.

There are plenty of songs on the two records that I like, but I never really cared who Rael is or what he was doing in the surreal landscape.

So for me, it's a number of songs that I like (maybe one record's worth) and a bunch of songs I could live without, and a story that doesn't drive me to keep listening. And for some reason, the story gets in the way of me just enjoying the songs individually (aside from a few like Counting Out Time and Carpet Crawlers).

So as a result, I've probably listened to it the least of any Genesis album with the exception of From Genesis to Revelation.
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xx Re: Anti-TLLDOB people: Why don't you like the alb
« Reply #10 on: May 21st, 2017, 05:52am »

on May 21st, 2017, 03:20am, DoubleGlazing wrote:
There are plenty of songs on the two records that I like, but I never really cared who Rael is or what he was doing in the surreal landscape.

The story isn't quite as strong as it could be, but when I listen to the album, I tend to care for Rael somewhat. He goes through a ton of stuff and develops as a result of it. He's not necessarily a strongly written character, but thanks to the music and atmospheres being so good, he's made believable.
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xx Re: Anti-TLLDOB people: Why don't you like the alb
« Reply #11 on: May 21st, 2017, 11:28am »

on May 21st, 2017, 03:20am, DoubleGlazing wrote:
I'm with Tony Banks. The story doesn't do much for me.


So for me, it's a number of songs that I like (maybe one record's worth)

I'm with you about the story, not really satisfying, Peter aimed very high and sort of missed there imo.
I do believe however, that the lyrics range from good to brilliant and as for the music, I believe that the songs on it are in a larger number than maybe a single record.
If that were the case it would be imo by far, the best single record of their career but personally I think there are songs for at least three great sides. Granted, the record sags a little at places but I personally don't know any double record which doesn't.
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question Re: Anti-TLLDOB people: Why don't you like the alb
« Reply #12 on: May 23rd, 2017, 10:54am »

I see a lot of negativity to the story and I understand that - at times it seems to be weird just to be weird or just 'artsy' - but I like it.

Peter Gabriel described it as a "Pilgrim's Progress," an allegory, like "Dante's Inferno" before it. In those, and in The Lamb, it is a journey into one's self, through one's own mind.

Rael, like the Pilgrim and Dante, must have an adventure to get back and along the way, face their fears and sins - and overcome them. Rael has to face his violence, lust, and when he's in despair, find something good about himself--when he rescues Brother John, he has found the part of him worth saving. But what is it? Imho, it's his act of self-sacrifice to brave the rapids and save John. He finally cared about someone other than himself.

So to me, the story is good, possibly even classical. But does the music always serve the story, or does the story serve the music? It should be both ways and a few tracks balance that way (e.g. Carpet Crawlers, Chamber, Back in NYC). Others, well, the music fights with the story and vice versa.
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xx Re: Anti-TLLDOB people: Why don't you like the alb
« Reply #13 on: May 23rd, 2017, 12:44pm »

on May 23rd, 2017, 10:54am, foxtwin wrote:
I see a lot of negativity to the story and I understand that - at times it seems to be weird just to be weird or just 'artsy' - but I like it.

Peter Gabriel described it as a "Pilgrim's Progress," an allegory, like "Dante's Inferno" before it. In those, and in The Lamb, it is a journey into one's self, through one's own mind.

Rael, like the Pilgrim and Dante, must have an adventure to get back and along the way, face their fears and sins - and overcome them. Rael has to face his violence, lust, and when he's in despair, find something good about himself--when he rescues Brother John, he has found the part of him worth saving. But what is it? Imho, it's his act of self-sacrifice to brave the rapids and save John. He finally cared about someone other than himself.

So to me, the story is good, possibly even classical. But does the music always serve the story, or does the story serve the music? It should be both ways and a few tracks balance that way (e.g. Carpet Crawlers, Chamber, Back in NYC). Others, well, the music fights with the story and vice versa.


Itís an interpretation and a good one at that, in fact if isn't about what you said, it should be.
Still it is difficult to relate to the character Rael, itís artificially created, set in a social, geographic and racial context the author knew nothing about and unavoidably and understandably it lacks depth.
It is a journey alright, in out but where for instance Danteís Divine Comedy was packed with historic figures and references, here again characters and scenarios are created from scratch and I really believe Peter bit off more than he could chew and more than the audience might have digested. The individual lyrics still are great because the man knows his craft.
Rage, sex, fear and other feelings and conditions are being explored, you feel itís building up to something and that something is the anti-climatic, both lyrically and musically, It?
I know many fans like that song but personally I think it wouldnít stand out on any of their previous records, more importantly, it fails to deliver the answers and provide the closure. As blurry and dodgy as the story is, it could have still been saved imo with a great Finale but personally I believe it fell sort of flat.
« Last Edit: May 23rd, 2017, 12:59pm by Fabrizio » User IP Logged

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question Re: Anti-TLLDOB people: Why don't you like the alb
« Reply #14 on: May 27th, 2017, 11:12pm »

The Lamb...is actually my favorite of the PG era Genesis albums, and a truly epic album. That said, IMO there are admittedly several of what I would call "filler" pieces in there that IMO may have served better simply being tagged onto the beginnings/ends of other tracks and just edited down. Kind of like the intro to Colony of Slippermen-that's a good comparison I think. Otherwise IMO pieces like The Waiting Room, Ravine, Silent Sorrow, etc. could've simply been left off the album as well, and may not have been all that missed in terms of the overall enjoyment of the album.

That said though, I love it! And this album has some of my favorite Genesis songs: In The Cage, Anyway, and Riding The Scree...
« Last Edit: May 27th, 2017, 11:13pm by Billys_Number » User IP Logged

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